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  1. NO, Kim!
    NOT a plague on their houses, DAMMIT!
    Strike force hits both houses, hostile takeover at the polls, in the voting booth, followed by a massive assault through Wall Street (hey, enough little guys with 5$ each can buy ANY massive conglomerate! Ever see an ant colony strip a dead cow?).
    THEN, WE take over and HEAL BOTH houses; like Jesus suuposedly threw the moneychangers out of the temple, we give the DemCong AND the Retarded Parties the Heave-Ho and start with NO Party System - just the PEOPLE, the REAL PEOPLE, the ones who WANT the nation to work, the ones that BELIEVE in the Constitution.
    YES, we DO NEED GOVERNMENT, because as soon as you get 4 people together, two of them will start arguing, the third one will try to mediate, and number 4 is going to either run for cover or pick up a gun and start shooting - and it’s six-five and pick ‘em.
    But DON’T put a Plague on ‘em; for better or worse, we DO need them both - HEALTHY, not sick, not broken.

    Author ID: 8889 | 1/17/2008 09:11 AM CST | #110097 |
  2. Yank,
    Your suggestions would all be helped immensely by Tinkerbelle sprinkling some magic pixie dust on the whole process.

    Author ID: 1 | 1/17/2008 09:37 AM CST | #110100 |
  3. As the Founders were quick to point out, the success of our nation requires freedom, but that freedom does not absolve anyone of their moral duties and responsibilities.

    This has been (and continues to be) the problem with free market absolutists.  In an absolutely free market, the most vile will succeed and stomp out the weak who are bound to moral principles FIRST. 

    I can’t count the number of times I’ve heard people say that morality has no place in business or things like “that’s just for suckers.”

    Corporations as a concept are quite simple.  They are a way (like with a marriage contract) of creating an entity that is owned by more than one person, or is unique from someone’s personal property.  There is nothing unique about them.  As with all things, it is the people involved, not the intangible/inanimate structure.

    The Founders were quick to give Congress the power to prevent some of the typical unscrupulous practices they had witnessed (or knew from history).  These include things like privately owned toll crossings/bridges or failure of private property owners to provide any sort of reasonable access (easements).  They were also savvy to the dangerous of monopolies and cartels.

    But I doubt they could have predicted the degree to which the love of money (or the desire to love saving it at the cost of moral principle) would have ever become so popular (and lauded).

    Government cannot (and should not) be required to create a law for every single method an immoral and greedy business owner invents to separate an honest man from his money.  That’s OUR job, as consumers, to only do business with individuals and business owners (regardless of their IRS filing status) who are moral people.

    We’ve had these discussions so many times on this website.  People, in general (and in a significant majority) DO NOT CARE.  They do not care, as long as they get their can of beans three cents cheaper.  They don’t care if that savings puts 7 people out of work in their hometown, causes their neighbors to become unemployed, or enables unfair or unscrupulous business practices.

    Until (and if) people DO care, there is nothing the government can do to fix it, except to create a never-ending list of regulations and restrictions that only the law-abiding and moral will attempt to comply with.  If people decide to care, in abundance, then the problems with evil business would the solved tomorrow.

    Let the buyer beware… and base all his purchasing decisions with his moral sense instead of his pocket cents.

    Sorry to be somewhat vague, but employer/honor in the spirit and letter of my confidentiality agreement prevents me from getting into specifics or naming names/laws/acts.

    Author ID: 2 | 1/17/2008 10:06 AM CST | #110103 |
  4. ...socialists (like Obama and Clinton) loathe corporations purely because their Marxist doctrine states that they should…

    Perhaps a bit of a thought this brings on might inspire some better writer to put down what I can’t:
    Not specifically corporations but conservatism/capitalism in general is what I was thinking of, this quoted sentiment reminded me.

    I think of it sort of like Brer Rabbit (I probably spelled that wrong) in a way…
    What we have to champion is not what we would choose if we thought about it.  We are handed the alternative by the enemy, who dutifully ‘complains’ no matter how much “our” side does what they would like to do themselves… they publicly decry the ‘enemy’, offer themselves as the fix… but they engineer “our” side, so that they get what they want either way.

    This is the inevitable result of the (in my opinion) excessive (to the point of suicide) tendency to compromise, to “support the republican no matter what”, to defend the NRA when it is baldly anti-Constitution…

    Anyway I’ll leave it at that and hopefully a better thinker will ‘get’ me or perhaps even point me to where it’s been done.

    Author ID: 9710 | 1/17/2008 10:55 AM CST | #110110 |
  5. This sort of thing is one of the reasons I dislike the whole “health care” brouhaha.  During WWII, companies competed for workers by offering them bennies, because they were forbidden to bid with higher pay.  And the suckers all thought that having the boss pay for their doctors’ services was peachy-keen...forgetting the Golden Rule: “He who has the gold, makes the rules.”

    Thanks to this, anybody with health problems has a hard time getting a job, which doesn’t help any.  In the Old Days, people paid for their own damn health insurance, often via a lodge...and not only were prices lower, but people had the lodge to get them out of their houses and interacting with their neighbors.

    Author ID: 7388 | 1/17/2008 12:13 PM CST | #110114 |
  6. This sort of thing is one of the reasons I dislike the whole “health care” brouhaha.

    You mean besides the lie that “1 in 7 Americans” BS?

    Every American, and even people here who aren’t Americans, has access to health CARE.  We’re not talking about ACCESS TO.  We’re talking about PAYING FOR.  It’s Orwellian speak.

    What everyone doesn’t have is health INSURANCE, but no one has added up the number of people, among the 47 million who have no insurance, how many DO NOT WANT IT because they pay out of pocket instead (or are themselves doctors or family’s of and go to buddies) or are already eligible for free everything because they’re too poor to pay for anything.

    This is exactly like the death penalty issue.  Everyone keeps complaining that we might execute an innocent, but no one has been able to show one example in the last 40 years where there was an innocent put to death.  They use examples of people who were on death row who were later found innocent… which shows that the system works, not that it doesn’t.

    Show me one person who can’t get their broken leg set at a hospital, despite their insurance status, and maybe we’ll have something to talk about.  I keep hearing about the person who MIGHT get sick and who MIGHT be denied access to a hospital (or any dozen free clinics or low-cost facilities) to be treated for a cold.

    If you don’t have insurance and get really sick, AFTER you have exhausted your money/assets, THEN you can get medicare.  What is the problem here? 

    With all the freebies in America, if you can’t find a doctor who’ll treat your cold for free or deferred payment, you have bigger problems than the cold.

    Author ID: 2 | 1/17/2008 12:46 PM CST | #110115 |
  7. I’m surprised today’s entry doesn’t include a link to Part I, esp. where it’s mentioned.

    When a company fires an employee for keeping a gun in his car in the company parking lot, a gun which he may need for self-defense on his way to and from his job at the company, why should we not support legislation which strips that piece of “private property rights” away from the company? When a company fires an employee for writing a memo which is not written in bland corporate-speak, but is written instead in plain (not profane) language, why should they not be fined (or sued) for such arbitrary behavior?

    The answer is that we are not animals like the left. We recognize the limit of authority in any entity, and we not only recognize but we invented the concept of the rights of others. While I do not like either of the behaviors you describe and would prefer no association with such enterprises, I recognize that no government has the legitimate authority to do the things proposed.

    Instead, we jawbone. We show people that their rights are sacred and not to be violated no matter in whose or what emergency’s name. We invest in and work for those companies which behave morally. If eventually that is not possible because of political action—and that, I am convinced, is everything behind what corporations do, including fear of Democrat-legislated-into-existence lawsuits—then we move to other responses, as our ancestors did. But first we make sure there is no hope of correction by the first three boxes of the famous quartet (though the third always seemed a bit late and unlikely, to me, since unjust laws are putatively supported by the general populace).

    The bond traders didn’t do anything to the Traitor’s government in 1993-1994. Buyers saw that an expansionist monetary policy and a punishing tax increase were bad for the value of fixed interest rate debt instruments and real economic growth, and moved away from them. Many then imagined all that trouble was over when the other party took power in November of 1994, but they’ve been slowly learning since 1999 that monetary policy is like God compared to a king’s power. Until enough wise men point out the basis of such problems as we’ve been suffering since the Clinton era began, fraud and libel will be the order of the day in politics for America’s real enemy’s side. And even longer, but they won’t succeed quite as well once the full truth is available and people have the guts to speak it loudly. The monstrosities the political left has committed just in the U.S. alone are enough to destroy them if only the truth is known.

    Author ID: 8165 | 1/17/2008 01:24 PM CST | #110119 |
  8. In a vastly overpopulated world, the economy has replaced all political systems, and states exist merely to ensure the survival of huge trans-national corporations, which in fact hold all political power. Advertising has become hugely aggressive and by far the best-paid profession.

    ...Wikipedia’s take on Space Merchants. IIRC, protagonist is bequeathed a “genuine walnut ring” when his wealthy mentor dies.

    Author ID: 6570 | 1/17/2008 01:40 PM CST | #110120 |
  9. A corporation might resist calls for the information from an insurance company (although don’t bet on it—all the insurance company need offer the company is a 10% reduction in premiums costs, and your data would be on their servers as fast as a T1 line could carry it).

    And all a corporation would have to do to convince its employees to go along with this slavery is to deduct FIVE percent from their salary if they did not consent to the intrusion. 
    People might become independent contractors to avoid this, but if the medical insurance companies wanted this, all it would take would be a five percent decrease in their Blue Cross/Blue Shield, and they would have a daily data upload.

    Didn’t anyone at Microsoft read 1984 as a dystopia—a cautionary tale? Or are they serving the corporate master so completely that they are anticipating the level of control the corporation will want next?

    Author ID: 2303 | 1/17/2008 01:58 PM CST | #110123 |
  10. If this software was being designed for good purposes, such as a person having the ability to see their own data (kept private for their eyes only), or a *government employee (who, by the nature of their work poses a significant risk to national security), it would make some sense… but without a law that would prevent a private company from using this technology on its employees, it’s a potential disaster.

    *I have no problem with people in government positions having a higher threshold… it’s what comes with the privilege of serving The People.  Someone who sits at a computer with all our SSNs or near The Button has an obligation to continually prove that they are not a risk to the public.  A government job is a privilege not a right.

    Author ID: 2 | 1/17/2008 02:08 PM CST | #110124 |
  11. I am reminded, unnervingly, of the future proposed in the roleplaying game Shadowrun; where if a corporation becomes large enough, it can apply for extraterritorial rights.

    As in, if you are on X Corp’s front lawn, you play by THEIR rules, not the rules of the country you’re in.

    Yeesh.

    --TR

    Author ID: 8034 | 1/17/2008 03:02 PM CST | #110125 |
  12. When a company fires an employee for keeping a gun in his car in the company parking lot, a gun which he may need for self-defense on his way to and from his job at the company, why should we not support legislation which strips that piece of “private property rights” away from the company?

    In my own not so very humble opinion I don’t think any company in the US should be able to deny employees the right to bear arms.  Private property rights refer to a person’s home, as in ‘a man’s home is his castle’.  If I’m invited into someone’s home and they request that I park my pistol at the door, fine.  It’s their home.  But at work?  No, never.

    They use examples of people who were on death row who were later found innocent…

    I’ll defer to Rule10b on this, but I don’t believe that’s quite accurate.  In several cases significant exculpatory evidence has been uncovered after trial that allows a judge to declare that a new trial be held.  In other instances cases are retried due to incompetent defense attorneys, evidence wrongfully withheld by police, and so forth.  The alleged perpetrator isn’t found innocent; the prosecutor is given a choice to either retry the case or drop the charges.  I have no statistics, but I’d be very curious to know how many cases are retried due to incompetent defense lawyers versus new evidence.

    Author ID: 7528 | 1/17/2008 04:09 PM CST | #110127 |
  13. Why would I tell anybody about what’s in my car in the parking lot, anyway?

    Author ID: 7388 | 1/17/2008 06:06 PM CST | #110130 |
  14. Does anybody remember a company called IBM and the way they ran roughshod over the IT industry.  Like elephants it takes time for a big business to die.

    The problem with socialists and populists is that in their efforts to pass laws to kill or control large corparations, they kill of small ones, even businesses that are not incorperated.
    Like elephants it takes time for a big business to die.

    Author ID: 67 | 1/17/2008 08:46 PM CST | #110132 |
  15. Property rights extend to any property you own.  It doesn’t matter if it is your business or your vacation property.  You set the rules on your property, PERIOD.

    We can respect another’s property rights and also try to convince them that they shouldn’t disallow people to keep guns in their cars.

    Author ID: 2 | 1/18/2008 04:44 AM CST | #110135 |
  16. I’m sure the Hillary/Obama socialists would settle for almost total control over corporations in our society. Foregoing a Stalinist/Maoist centralization of the means of production in exchange for de facto control of corporations is a ‘means’ to the end of total power acquisition. They’re a long way toward that control already. PCness, Affirmative Action, Sarbannes/Oxley, tax collection, the SEC, OSHA, FDA and on and on and on makes the point! So let the corps exist as long as they ‘serve the common good’ i.e. the socialists.

    Sort of a National Socialism, remember that?

    BTW, the big losers in a society such as that will be blacks who are a perfect distraction and scapegoat.

    Author ID: 9349 | 1/18/2008 05:43 AM CST | #110138 |
  17. I understand that a corporation is considered legally a “person”, and is in many ways treated the same as an individual human, with the same legal rights.  The corporate form of organization has been hugely successful in developing the modern economy.  But, I am troubled by the kind of arrogant intrusiveness that Kim talks about.  There is something wrong when an organization intrudes upon individual rights without a compelling reason.

    As Kim points out, neither the socialists nor the populists have a good answer to the problems he cites.  Part of the problem is a lack of accountability on the part of decision makers.  The strength of the corporate form is that it shields the stockholders from personal liability for the actions of the corporation.  Decisions are made by hired managers and executives who are frequently shielded from responsibility by bureaucratic anonimity.  The corporation winds up functioning as an economic automaton, pursuing corporate goals with no ethical or philosophical moderation.

    Should an automaton have the same rights as a living individual?  Does the phrase “life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness” even have any meaning when applied to a corporate entity?  Should the property rights of an automaton be the same as the property rights of a living being?  Property rights are an important foundation of a free society, and I would not suggest limiting them without a compelling reason.  But, I think when property rights of a corporation interfere with basic human rights to life and liberty there is a case to be made that the rights of actual human individuals take precedence over the property rights of the corporation.

    I think that, in general, corporate overreach is a symptom of a basic problem in the way corporations are treated as individuals, under the law.  I don’t think we should adopt the kind of wholesale destruction of the corporate form, as the socialists and populists whould propose.  But, I think we need to think more about what modifications of current practice might be advisable.

    Author ID: 566 | 1/18/2008 07:35 AM CST | #110160 |

Thursday, January 17, 2008


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When Elephants Stumble (Part II)

January 17, 2008
7:59 AM CST

I have written before about the dangers of allowing corporations to become government surrogates—a shining example being companies being responsible for “withholding” employees’ taxes, rather than having said employees actually write checks to the IRS each month. (I bet people would have a completely different attitude towards government spending if they had to do that, rather than having the painless transparency of automatic withholding.) In this way, not only does the corporation do the government’s job of tax collection, but, as the government ultimately has the power of life and death over the corporation, they do a better job of it than the government ever could.

But it’s not just taxes. Look at any corporate codes of behavior, and you’ll find policies which, in their breathtaking reach and intrusiveness, would make 1984‘s O’Brien nod his head approvingly. In many cases, the political correctness on display exceeds that of any government department—in no small part because office workers and middle management, unlike government workers, are not shielded from such excesses by an employees’ union.

Note too that corporations are often stooges of other corporations—corporations often spy on their employees, nominally for the employees’ “own good” (to see, for example, if they smoke and/or drink excessively over weekends), but in reality, the spying and “corrective action” which follows is done simply to keep medical insurance payments down.

Add the trial lawyer industry to the mix, and it’s a wonder that any corporation can survive when it is so weighed down with all this nonsense. And in fact, there is good evidence to suggest that the sclerotic performance of major U.S. corporations in recent times has in no small part been because of the stifling thickets of rules and regulations (imposed from both without and within) that they have to negotiate just to do the most rudimentary business.

There is abundant evidence that this trend of corporate intrusiveness and busybodied-ness is not diminishing, but increasing:

Microsoft is developing Big Brother-style software capable of remotely monitoring a worker’s productivity, physical wellbeing and competence.

The Times has seen a patent application filed by the company for a computer system that links workers to their computers via wireless sensors that measure their metabolism. The system would allow managers to monitor employees’ performance by measuring their heart rate, body temperature, movement, facial expression and blood pressure.

In Part I, I talked about corporations getting too big for their britches, and this is a classic example.

The more worrying aspect of this kind of development is that once collected, such data would prove irresistible to others—and by others, I mean health insurance companies and ultimately, government.

A corporation might resist calls for the information from an insurance company (although don’t bet on it—all the insurance company need offer the company is a 10% reduction in premiums costs, and your data would be on their servers as fast as a T1 line could carry it).

A corporation could not resist a demand from the government that they transmit to data to, oh, OSHA or Health & Human Services, to name just two. And why wouldn’t the corporation do that? After all, they already ship your money to the government; biometric data is just another series of bits and bytes.

All this is done, of course, under the fig leaf of “private property”—the idea that a property owner (the corporation) has a right to determine the terms and conditions of behavior on its property, just as a homeowner has the right to do so with guests on his. A moment’s thought will reveal the speciousness of this argument. Guests in a man’s home do not depend on him for money to feed themselves and their families. Corporations, on the other hand, are contracting for a person’s time and labor—but that does not give them an excuse to regulate a person’s behavior excessively—which, given the opportunity, they will do. Of course, the argument is that the employee is free to refuse the terms and conditions of employment, and seek compensation elsewhere. Except that choices are always limited, especially when all the corporations and business entities in the area have similar, equally-intrusive regulations.

Which brings me, finally, to the point of this series.

I note with extreme displeasure the two strains of anti-corporatism running through our body politic at the moment. The first is unsurprising: socialists (like Obama and Clinton) loathe corporations purely because their Marxist doctrine states that they should. The second strain is a populist one (such as espoused by people like Huey Long and Mike Huckabee): the theory that “the big guy” is out to screw “the little guy”.

Populists couch their hatred of corporations in terms of money (which is why, generally speaking, populists are stupid people—they become the unwitting accomplices of the socialists, who are truly feral creatures), and socialists couch their hatred in terms of control—because, as we all know, socialists are leery of sharing power with any entity, believing as they do that all power should lie exclusively with the State. Ultimately, of course, as the man said: when politicians converse, no matter what the topic, they’re talking about money. Your money (or in the case of socialists, their money, because they hold that all capital, however earned, is the property of the State).

Both populists and socialists are dangerous, because both would weaken and destroy businesses (which I don’t much care about, anymore) and the nation’s economy (which I do care about) through their utterly useless and failed philosophies.

The problem is that corporations, in my opinion, are rapidly losing the right to any degree of sympathy from voters. When a company fires an employee for keeping a gun in his car in the company parking lot, a gun which he may need for self-defense on his way to and from his job at the company, why should we not support legislation which strips that piece of “private property rights” away from the company? When a company fires an employee for writing a memo which is not written in bland corporate-speak, but is written instead in plain (not profane) language, why should they not be fined (or sued) for such arbitrary behavior?

So while I don’t support the likes of either populist Mike Huckabee or socialist Hillary Clinton. let me tell you: I’m not a huge fan of CitiBank, AT&T or Sears either. In fact, as far as I’m concerned, the two sides can battle it out until both are bloody: corporations litigated almost out of existence by a feral Clintonite Justice Department (e.g.. as was tried with Microsoft in the late 1990s), or government bankrupted by Wall Street’s bond traders (ditto the Clintons in the early 1990s).

The only problem is that when elephants stumble, the beings most affected are the ants underfoot. And we are the ants, harassed, crippled and eventually destroyed by stupid policies made by giant, unfeeling, faceless corporate and governmental entities.

A plague on both their houses.




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